When Jennifer Burwell hired an executive coach to help her find what was holding her back, she discovered all kinds of hidden issues that turned out to stem from unresolved trauma. That coach changed her life when she found ways to delete those traumas and create a whole new strength and ability to succeed.
In today's Podcast, Modern Divorce Host Billie Tarascio talks with Jennifer about how the common dramas we experience get hidden away as unresolved trauma that affects our lives.
There are ways of unraveling those traumas - whether big or small. She explains the processes here, and also offers help from her website, MothersAndFoundersCo.com.
When Jennifer Burwell hired an executive coach to help her find what was holding her back, she discovered all kinds of hidden issues that turned out to stem from unresolved trauma. That coach changed her life when she found ways to delete those traumas and create a whole new strength and ability to succeed.
In today's Podcast, Modern Divorce Host Billie Tarascio talks with Jennifer about how the common dramas we experience get hidden away as unresolved trauma that affects our lives.
There are ways of unraveling those traumas - whether big or small. She explains the processes here, and also offers help from her website, MothersAndFoundersCo.com.
Billie Tarascio: [00:00:00] Hi there. This is Billie Tarascio with the Modern Divorce podcast here today with a very fun episode about breaking through whatever your barriers are, wherever you might feel stuck in your business or your life. And we're going to talk about bursting through figuring out what's keeping you stuck and I'm here today to help us with that is Jennifer Burwell. Hi, Jennifer.
Jennifer Burwell: Hi, thank you for having me. Thank you for being here.
Billie Tarascio: Thank you for being here. Tell us a little bit about you and your organization [00:01:00] there.
Jennifer Burwell: Um, so my, like I said, my name is Jennifer Burwell. Um, I have about 13 years in organizational development, so I've been helping small to midsize organizations scale. Get unstuck, create strategy and systems around their people and processes.
And, um, so I've been in the entrepreneurial community for almost a decade over a decade, and it's been so fun. But what I realized in that journey is we can put all the plans on paper and everybody can say, yep, we're going to go and we're going to do this. But if the leader, um, has unresolved things that they're not dealing with, um, personally.
It really impacts the rest of the organization. So we were running into a lot of roadblocks, um, and leaders, sometimes they lack self-awareness or they're not really seeing, what's keeping them stuck. And so maybe sometimes people around them or. Um, and I found that my own journey, I was really wanting to go to quote unquote, next level, and I just kept getting stuck and I couldn't figure out how I could show up more authentically, like the person that I wanted to.
[00:02:00] And I hired a executive coach, like many high-level leaders do, and she changed my life. And I know that sounds so cliche and people roll their eyes, but she really, really did. And she helped me see. That I had a lot of things that I needed to unpack and to heal from. And so one of the things that I did with her is trauma integration.
And she really helped me realize that I had a lot of things in my past that I tried to just push away, put on that bookshelf. Like I'm not going to deal with that. I'm just going to keep moving forward. Um, and as I processed it, new things happened. I, I mean, people will tell me like, Hey, you look like a completely different person.
Um, it gave me the courage to start my own company and really follow my own passions and focus on women, entrepreneurship, small business owners. And, um, so I went and got certified in the same modality as her. So now I do business strategy and also this trauma healing piece. Cause I really think that if you look at people comprehensively as a whole person, um, It's it's [00:03:00] much more successful than in, in your business, any personal life, if you're dealing with all of it, because we are a one person, right.
Especially for small business owners wear a lot of different hats, but we're still one person.
Billie Tarascio: Okay. Um, that was fantastic. There was a lot there. I guess my first question is how do you know if you
Jennifer Burwell: are stuck? Yeah, that is a good question. Um, it usually comes for people as like frustration. Um, sometimes it's not achieving a goal.
So if you've set a goal that you've been working towards them a long time and you just can't figure it out for some reason, um, sometimes it's people around you give you feedback. Um, for some leaders, it's, um, a key employee leaves and that's a painful and painful lesson to learn. Um, it's so it's really just, you have to become aware and listen to your body.
Um, and that's hard for really busy people. So. [00:04:00] First, you have to just kind of check in and say like, where is this frustration coming from? Do I feel frustration? And once you can recognize that, then you're on a path to like, try to solve it. Um, so awareness is, is key, but a lot of times it starts externally like some feedback that you're going to get from, from people around you, um, family members to begin to identify like, Hmm.
Maybe I, I'm not showing up how I want to be, because we think we're one way in our minds. And then when we get feedback from others, like, Hmm. That's not what's happening. That's a good indication to take a little look about what's going on. Okay.
Billie Tarascio: And what, explain the modality.
Jennifer Burwell: Yeah. So for trauma integration, it's a mindfulness practice.
So I'm really a guide for you to make sure that you stay safe. Um, for, so for trauma, uh, people who've experienced trauma, and I guess I should first define trauma. Trauma is a big, scary word for a lot of people. And if we don't think of, we think of it as like the big [00:05:00] things that are definitely traumatic, but it's also the micro things that happen to us.
It's, I've processed things for people that. Uh, comment. Somebody said on a playground when they were five years old, that they've held in their body and it's, it's impacted the way that they show up how they think about themselves. And it's not on a conscious level. Like you don't think about, Hey, Johnny said this to me when I was five.
And so that's why I get anxious in a room full of people. I don't know, but that is in our subconscious. And so it's all of these things that are shot have shocked our body. Because when our body gets shocked, we go into flight fight or freeze, and our brain wants to protect us. So we, so our brain doesn't digest that shock.
It kind of puts a little bubble around it and pushes it away and what you need to do to be able to move past it, to desensitize it and to allow your brain to read. I just, it in your body. As you have to go through the processing. So there's many different ways you can go through this way that we process is we [00:06:00] began with three to five minutes of really deep breathing.
So that you can just be come quiet. And then I invite the person to just share whatever comes to their mind, a story that brought them, shame, sadness, um, confusion, discomfort, embarrassment. Um, and then we sit quiet and the person, whatever story comes up is the story that we process. And so, as they're telling their story, um, the cool thing is a lot of times trauma people or people who've experienced.
Trauma scrambles our brains. So the timeline is very confusing. We don't know what happened first or second, and this process that's not important. So it's not even important if it really did happen, because what we're saying is what our bodies experienced. So whatever the story is, we'd go through it. And then we do some reparenting.
So we'd go back to our younger self and tell ourselves what we needed to hear. So a lot of clients like myself, experienced [00:07:00] trauma as a child. So we can go back to that younger self. And although the people around us, maybe our parents who were supposed to be able to say the things they, they weren't able to, for whatever reason, we can go back and tell ourselves that so that we know, um, that our inner child is safe and secure with our adults.
And we do a lot of reparenting to that's very healing for people. Um, And then we also do some breathing, some affirmation, um, if there's a situation where someone felt powerless and didn't, wasn't able to say what they wanted to say, we give them that opportunity. So, um, for people who are survivors of abuse or who were victimized in any way, they can say what they were wanting to say or do.
Um, this is also really powerful for, um, people who've experienced sexual abuse as a child because a lot of times they felt powerless and they couldn't do anything. And there's a lot of shame or guilt around like not fighting back, quote, unquote, not fighting back as hard as you want to. [00:08:00] And so. You can talk to that.
Um, and then, um, we end with breathing, releasing it from our bodies. So trauma shows up in our bodies in different places. And so we want to really figure out where it's, where we're holding it. Sometimes it's knees backs, arms all over, um, and we focus our energy and release it, um, from our bodies.
Billie Tarascio: That sounds like a very intense experience.
Jennifer Burwell: Yeah. It varies from person to person. Um, but it can be so my own story, um, I grew up in a very dysfunctional family. Um, And I experienced sexual abuse as a child myself. And so I've been through a therapy probably since I was 20 with a lot of different modalities. And this was the one that I was able to finally process that abuse because it was something that was so far.
Like I had it in my mind of like, I am not touching that with a 10 foot pole because I've moved on I'm quote unquote, like [00:09:00] a functioning human I've gotten, you know, married kids, all the things, and I'm not going to deal with that. And, um, this was the process that I finally felt safe enough because that's the big thing is you have to feel safe and supported, um, to process it.
And it really was the piece that I needed to heal to move forward. And so, um, That's what really sold me like this really can help people. Um, and I've also helped, like I said, people who've had, you know, bullying or experiences on a playground or, um, all sorts of embarrassment. Um, you know, someone fell and was embarrassed in front of a group of people like those sorts of things as well.
Um, we just don't realize how much of an impact those memories have on our, on the way we show up today.
Billie Tarascio: Yeah. So as you're talking, I'm thinking, you know, every one of us has adverse experiences. [00:10:00] That's just part of being human. Um,
so I don't know. I guess it goes back to the first question of how do you know if you need to do some work and it's, if you're, if you're stuck, if you feel stuck or if you're showing up the way you don't want to show up, if you find yourself triggered by certain experiences or behaviors like that, that sounds like the clue, because we can, we can all go back and inventory every slight, but I'm not sure that that's
Jennifer Burwell: going to be effective.
No, I know. And you definitely don't want to do that. It's when you do feel stuck or, um, Working with somebody who, um, is like, I'm always angry at my kids. Like the littlest thing makes me so mad. And that was his clue that was like, Hey, I need to do something. And, you know, I can make a big, a good argument that everyone needs somebody and some type of personal development.
Um, But it really is those triggers or like, you know, I just don't want to feel so [00:11:00] angry all the time. Um, for me it really was these triggers of like, when somebody does something and our closest relationships, right? So husbands, um, former husbands that like people that are closest to us when they do something and your reaction is like, I had 10 out of 10 when.
If you thought about it, um, objectively most people's reaction would be a three out of 10 that tells you that it's it's, that what's happening, but it's also triggering something from your past. And so when I didn't have a lot of this healing, when my husband would do something very simple, At, uh, I can't even think of an example now, but it would send me off a handlebar and it wasn't because of what necessarily what he did.
It brought me back to like that seven year old girl who didn't feel supported and abandoned. And so that was my move. Like, Hey, if I, um, don't want to destroy, like destroy a relationship, I probably should figure this out or [00:12:00] figure my piece out. Right. Because we can only figure out our own stuff, but.
Billie Tarascio: Okay.
I think that's really good. It definitely gives us a clue. You know, when yeah. When do you leave a situation and you're like, what are they do? That, that is probably like the clue that you have an opportunity to resolve something. Um, and I think, you know, I know for me getting out of a marriage the times when I would feel like, oh, why did I show up that way?
It was meetings that involve. My ex-husband and the school about our kids. That was, that was a massive trigger for me because of the way that I felt powerless, because I was sharing decision-making with somebody who didn't support my position and doing EMDR, which is a trauma therapy. [00:13:00] Yeah, it has made a massive difference.
And now we can have meetings and I can be like an objective reasonable, rational human. Yes, much, much better place to show
Jennifer Burwell: up. Absolutely. Yeah, I've done the EMDR too as well. Um, and it is, it is this it's that shift. That's what you're looking for. So however you get that shift of the same thing, so same situation, but it's just, you show up differently and it affects your body and your mind and spirit in a different way, because you've done, then you're on work.
And that's not to say that, like, you're probably still feel frustration, right? Like at those meetings and
Billie Tarascio: But it's rational and reasonable, and I'm under control. And I get to decide how to show. Right. So for me, that's, that's major. Like I don't, I don't want to lose power. I don't want to lose the ability to show up as my best self when I'm trying to advocate for my kids, you know, insert your, your situation wherever you are.
The other place that, um, I see [00:14:00] this happen a lot. Is with relationships. So maybe you're trying to fix your relationship. You know, you're listening to this podcast, you think you're probably headed for divorce and you're stuck on something. Maybe it was an affair that this other person had. Maybe it was whatever it was.
You might really love each other and have the ability to move through it. But you're stuck.
have you ever heard that come up?
Jennifer Burwell: Oh my gosh. Yes. All the time. Um, I have many clients this, that scenario, exactly. And, um, to share for me personally, Um, in 20, so I've been married for nine years and in 2019, um, I had just had my daughter whose birthday is sick day.
Um, but I found it's a very long story, but basically I found some things on my husband's cell phone that was not appropriate for a man to have. Okay. So of course that triggers all of my stuff, but also like that situation warrants a pretty significant response. So like it was, it was [00:15:00] rough. Right. And I definitely was like, so my grandmother has been married and divorced four times.
My mom has been married and divorced four times. So like, this is like the family lineage of like, I have a long history of, of, um, different relationships and all that. So in my mind, I was like, well, like this is a deal breaker we're done. Um, and what I decided was. I'm going to get the help that I need because I need to heal.
I came and I went to marriage, counseling therapy, all that stuff, but I was like, you know, I need to own my part in this. I'm not excusing any of them behavior at all, but I'm going to do my work and I'm going to see what happens and if he can commit to his work and I, if I do my work and then I'm going to decide where, where we go and what happened when I, when I did my work is I was able to.
I mean, it took like a year and a half of reel of every week therapy counseling. Um, but I was able to forgive him, [00:16:00] but now I'm in a place where, um, I can more objectively see that I will forgive you like my boundaries. I will forgive you once. If it happens again, I feel, I know that I have the internal resources that I could make a decision to make a change.
Whereas before I was this scared, afraid of abandonment, like, oh, I'll just accept bad behavior because I don't want to be alone. And so. It just feels like a much like what you were saying. Like, it feels like a much more powerful place to be, to know, like, I honestly, 100% know that like, no matter what happens, I will be okay on my own.
And I've never felt that before. And, um, and it's not that I want something bad to happen. Of course. Like I want it to work out, but I I'm, I really am. If I have it in my head, like, okay, well, [00:17:00] if he just, I, I can't control his choices. Right. He's, he's made commitments and promises. Um, I, in a million years, I would have never, ever thought that he did what he did.
And like, I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt because we've rebuilt trust. And I know that I have the resources that stirred something happen. I'm okay.
Pretty incredible. You're fully present and fully committed. And also fine. If, if, if what is today, if this wonderful relationship that you're fully in right now doesn't last forever. It's okay.
Absolutely. And that has been a huge shift because, because of. I I would be okay. I know that I'd be okay, man.
Would it be hard and awful and terrible? Yes. I know that. And I know there would be terrible days, but coming from the past that [00:18:00] I've had in watching my mom have multiple relationships, I was so angry as a child. And I was so angry as a teenager and I had so much judgment and I had so much my mother and I had a very difficult relationship and I blamed her for a lot of it.
You know, I didn't have the perspective that I have now, but now looking back and being a parent and an adult and realizing about like, marriage is really hard. I have a lot more respect for my mom and for the journey that she's been on. But I went into my late twenties when I met my husband of like, I'm never going to be like my mom, I'm never getting divorced.
I'm I'm going to stay married no matter what. And my, and the evolution and the healing that I've done has realized like, Probably not a good strategy because staying married just to say, you're staying married could be so much more harmful. And if, if Brett and I grow apart and we're on separate journeys, I'm in a place where I could honor that and acknowledge that's [00:19:00] probably for our highest and best for both of us.
And there isn't that guilt or shame or disappointment, or like, I would feel like a failure because. And that's just not how life works. Like my great grandmother stayed married. And her husband had an affair with somebody down the street. And the family story is they, she just got two twin beds and they slept in twin beds, the rest of their life.
Like no one wants that. Right? Like, so I could go on and on, but that's been my evolution in journey.
Billie Tarascio: What we're talking about today is going to resonate with so many people, because there are people in their marriages who are stuck in contempt, stuck. You really, really don't like your husband. You really, really, really don't like the things that he has done to you.
Um, whether it's taking you for granted or, you know, cheating on you or financially cheating or whatever, there have been massive, like big breaks in trust. And I used to think [00:20:00] that it was. The thing that caused divorce was allowing deal breaker behavior to happen over time because those things happen.
You're not ready to get divorced, you just deal with it. Um, and you're just waiting for it to happen again. And you're just looking for it to happen again and, and something might happen and you're like, it's here again. And you're just, you're there. You're in that space. And that is not a space where any marriage or relationship can thrive.
Right, but it's very difficult to figure out how to heal that because there's two things that have to happen. You have to figure out within yourself how to actually process it and let it go, which I never did in my marriage.
Jennifer Burwell: And it's really hard. Yeah. And so there, that is the two pieces. And so it's
Billie Tarascio: like reconciliation with your partner and reconciliation with yourself.
Jennifer Burwell: Right, right. Because if I can never get to forgiveness, that was w that was one of the things our counselor therapist said, like, if you can never get to the forgiveness, then there's no point in this [00:21:00] continuing, and you don't have to get to forgiveness today, but you have to see that it's possible.
And that you're working towards that. And so, um, that was really, really, really hard for me because, you know, there was all the things. My husband's very aware of my past and all the affairs and things in my family history and how devastating was all those things. And the promise that he made was that would never be me.
And so having to realize like, okay, well, here we are. And can I get to forgiveness? And the only way I got to forgiveness was I made some specific requests. One of them was like going to counseling therapy. He had to change some things and do his own work. But for me, it was like, I have to heal myself. And that was my own separate journey that I had to do on my own.
Um, a couple of times it was like solo weekend vacations that I did to just like journal and be by myself some time, just break from the kids and chaos and like really a lot of self care. Um, And [00:22:00] I was really lucky to be able to do that and have that opportunity. But then the big piece was just really feeling this.
And so I processed this event a couple of times in my trauma integration. And, um, I feel sadness around the events, but I don't feel the rage and the like contempt where I was like, there was a period of time where I was like, if you look at me, I'm doing. Probably
Billie Tarascio: if you pick up your phone, you know, just like, yeah.
Yeah. Okay. So I know that our listeners are connecting with what you're saying, because this is just so true for all of us. How does that impact your ability to grow your business?
Jennifer Burwell: Yeah. I mean, like I said, in the beginning, so small business, one person, right? So when we have these sorts of things that are going on in our lives, or, um, when we're feeling triggered it, we cannot be in a space of expansion.
Right? Base of fear and control most of the time. So we're trying to [00:23:00] control everything where micromanaging, um, or not sure why we're not growing because we're still probably working 12, 14, 16 hour days, but we're just not growing it's because there's so much of it for a small business owner about mindset and about what space and what energy you are when we show up.
And so, I mean, when you're having personal things, they definitely bleed into your professional life and professional. Definitely bleeds into your personal life. We're all just one thing. Um, so a lot of times I'll see just frustrated, overwhelmed, overworked, and unsupported business owners that show up and they're just throw their hands up in there.
And when they come to me, sometimes they're usually like, I will try anything. Like, it sounds a little woo to me, but set me up because I'm writing three
Billie Tarascio: to five minutes of deep breathing. Sounds like an eternity.
Jennifer Burwell: Yeah. Well, no, the first time or two times, you're like, oh my gosh, how long is this what's going to happen?
But then you really get used to it. How often if [00:24:00] ever do we have that time to really just that the level of breathing that we're doing, it gets you into, um, almost a state of hypnosis. It's not hypnosis. You're like you're not hypnotized or anything, but it is that deep. So where you can really listen to your inner self with.
Without me guiding you it's doesn't happen normally in our day-to-day life.
Billie Tarascio: Absolutely. Making time for that. It just doesn't happen. Absolutely. Um, okay. So Jennifer, how do people work with you?
Jennifer Burwell: Yeah, so you can go to my website at MotherAndFounderCo.com. You can fill out a form. Um, I'm most active on the Instagram.
Um, my Instagram page I guess, um, at mother and founder co where I share a lot of tips. So I talk about, um, business strategy and then also the trauma healing there, where I tried to give as many tips and resources, um, actually have a small business seminar coming up. It's a virtual five-part workshop, um, which you are speaking up Ellie and [00:25:00] so excited for you.
Um, and it's just really about foundation and basics. So if you're thinking about getting into business, if you think about entrepreneurship or you're our small business owner, I want to revisit, um, tax planning, how to buy a house, like things to think about in family law, prenups, post steps. Um, we also have a financial planner.
Um, so it's going to be a great series. Um, but I try to provide some, a lot of free resources. I also have a trauma, um, support service. That's one the first Tuesday of the month at six o'clock in Mesa. So everybody is welcome.
Billie Tarascio: Fantastic. Thank you so much. I really appreciate your time today. I will let you go get to your daughter's birthday.
Did you see she's
Jennifer Burwell: three?
Yeah, she just turned three. Oh,
Billie Tarascio: have a great day. Have a wonderful birthday celebration. And thank you so much for your time. If you all have enjoyed this episode, make sure to like comment and subscribe. So you don't miss any more of the Modern Divorce podcast. Also feel free to [00:26:00] send in your questions for Jennifer or for me, or any topics that you would like to see on the show.
Thank you so much,
jennifer.
Jennifer Burwell: You're welcome. Thanks for having